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    Repeat FLR visas

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    makem
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    Repeat FLR visas

    Post by makem on 29/11/10, 07:41 pm

    handyal, Alan, font of all knowledge Wink

    Do you know if there is a cap on the number of times your wife can apply for FLR?
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    handyal
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by handyal on 29/11/10, 08:39 pm

    Hi Eric,
    I have never read of a specific cap being placed on FLR applications.
    However the only reason I can think of that would stop you applying for ILR, and therefore keep applying for FLR, is if your wife couldn't meet the requirements of obtaining an ESOL certificate. Their are special provisions in these circumstances.

    Why ? What are you thinking ?
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by makem on 30/11/10, 12:04 am

    I was just thinking if a wife was unable to pass the ESOL requirement how many times an FLR could be requested.

    At the school where Han is learning there are several Nationalities and at least 2, one of whom is Spanish are having great difficulty even after living in the UK for several years.

    It was just a thought that cropped up that you could keep paying year after year (if you could afford it) and the test need never be taken/passed.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 30/11/10, 12:47 am

    One Chinese guy at my wife's ESOL class had been here more than 10 years. He was running a Chinese restaurant and employed Chinese staff and relied on his kids to speak English for him. He passed his UK driving license by using a translator sat in the back of the car. He must have been renewing his FLR every year or two but the rules have changed a lot over the last ten years.

    I wonder if your wife could apply for UK Citizenship after living here for three years and married to a UK Citizen without ever applying for ILR?
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by handyal on 30/11/10, 07:27 am

    Hi Eric,
    Remember people from Spain or other EU citizens do not have the same incentive to pass any english test. The ESOL requirement is only for Overseas nationalities. Many EU citizens take the courses just out of self learning or to claim benifits without the need to work. i.e. If they are in full time education (which is classified as only 12 hours each week).

    Look at the status of FLR. You pay a fee every two years. You can work and pay taxes and NI contributions, but you can't claim any benifits. Why would the Government upset the gravy machine. You give, they take.

    Hi David,
    Of course she could. You would have applied for one FLR though.
    The 'Life in the UK Test' is a higher standard of an ESOL course. (They recommend you should be at entry level 3 to take the LITUK test). Passing this test without an ESOL also qualifies you to apply for ILR and/or British citizenship.

    I know a couple who passed the LITUK test by memorising the questions and answers. They never took any ESOL courses.
    They have ILR but can't read, write, or speak English. In my opinion, your only cheating yourself using this method.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 30/11/10, 08:41 am

    Of course you can keep resitting the "Life in the UK" test every month until you pass it. It costs about 40 a time which might be cheaper than reapplying for the FLR. My wife failed the "Life in the UK" test the first time and refused to resit it as she doesn't like to fail anything. Life in the UK was included in the ESOL course she did which meamt that she could get around sitting the "Life in the UK" as a separate exam. Although she now has her ILR she still goes to ESOL classes to continue to improve her English and I think it is more of a social club to meet other people from the area.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by makem on 30/11/10, 11:00 am

    davidmckendrick wrote:Of course you can keep resitting the "Life in the UK" test every month until you pass it. It costs about 40 a time which might be cheaper than reapplying for the FLR.

    To sit the Life in the UK test you must first get FLR surely? I read that unless you can already speak quite good English you could not pass.

    The ESOL courses include Life in the UK but nothing like the above test and it is not tested as such. The tests are reading, writing, listening and speaking.

    I find it confusing that a test is named the same as part of the ESOL course. Han wanted to take and studied the Life in the UK test until I pursueded her she could never pass until she learned more at ESOL and then she would not need to pass it!

    Or so I thought.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by Beijing2008 on 30/11/10, 12:02 pm

    ad Handyal;
    you say someone could pass the LITUK test by learning by hart. Isn't the real test different from the course, so in the real test other questions.
    I know here at the Integration exam , which in UK is ESOL, the text and the questions are ,for a great deal,totally different from the studybooks.
    So learning by heart only helps here a bit.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 30/11/10, 12:10 pm

    You can sit the "Life in the UK" test anytime. You do not need a new visa as you have 2 years on the Settlement visa. My wife practised online answering the multichoice questions but failed despite getting 80% to 90% when practising. Since it is online you do not need to speak or understand spoken English, just be able to read English.

    The first ESOL course my wife started on was mainly for Polish workers in UK and they had a Polish teacher. There was no "Life in the UK" included in the course and there was no exam and therefore no certificate which was no good for the ILR so she changed Colleges. She made sure that the new ESOL course included an element of "Life in the UK" and that there was a certificate. She got a separate letter from the College stating that there was a "Life in the UK" element to the course and this was accepted when she applied for ILR.
    Mei's son also does ESOL at school as a separate subject but he got his ILR because he was under 18 and a dependant when Mei got hers. There was no requirement for him to learn English for his ILR.
    Even Australians and Americans have to sit the "Life in the UK" test if they want ILR even though they do not need to pass an ESOL exam. But EU Citizens who cannot speak any English can stay here, work and collect benefits for as long as they like.

    David
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 30/11/10, 12:16 pm

    The questions on the LITUK test are the same as on the website but they have thousands of questions to choose from. The questions are slightly different if you are sitting the exam in Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland or England. Things like "St Andrews Day" or "St Georges Day" for instance.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by handyal on 30/11/10, 08:22 pm

    Just a correction to the information you have stated.

    ESOL and the LITUK are completely seperate, both serve a different purpose for different circumstances.
    ESOL courses do not contain any elements of Life in the UK material.
    ESOL courses contain elements of citizenship materials (not LITUK) which includes day to day events such as shopping, joining a gym, a job interview etc. English history, politics, law etc are virtually non existant. ESOL teaches basic english skills to deal with normal daily activities.
    LITUK deals much more with questions about UK history, the law, politics. (It presumes ones english is already sufficient to deal with day to day activities).

    http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/settlement/knowledge-language-life/demonstrating/
  • If your English skills are at or above ESOL Entry 3 level (see below), you will need to pass the 'Life in the UK test'.
  • If your English skills are below ESOL Entry 3 level (see below), you will need to take and pass a course in English for speakers of other languages (ESOL) which contains citizenship materials.

    If you are an English speaker - the Life in the UK test.
  • If your English skills are at or above ESOL Entry 3 level or Scottish Intermediate 1 level, you will need to pass the Life in the UK test before you apply for settlement. This test consists of 24 multiple-choice questions, based on the information in the handbook 'Life in the UK: A Journey to Citizenship' (ISBN: 9780113413133).

    If you are not an English speaker - ESOL and citizenship course.

    If your English skills are below ESOL Entry 3 level (or Intermediate 1 level in Scotland), you must take an ESOL with citizenship course and obtain a relevant qualification to demonstrate your knowledge of language and life in the UK.


    ESOL courses are available throughout the UK - the Directgov website can help you find a course at the right level in your area.
    The Immigration Rules for ESOL courses changed on 7 April 2010. If you want to demonstrate your knowledge of language and life with an ESOL qualification, you must now meet the following requirements:


    • You must have attended your ESOL course at an accredited college.
    • The course must have included citizenship materials derived from the document 'Citizenship Materials for ESOL Learners' (ISBN: 1-84478-5424).
    • You must have obtained a relevant ESOL qualification from an approved awarding body.
    • You must demonstrate that you have made relevant progress.


    There are two versions of ESOL available:
    ESOL not necessarily through an accredited college and not containing citizenship material. These courses are ideal for EU migrants who already have the right to reside in the UK. Useless for overseas migrants seeking permanent residence in the UK.
    ESOL through an accredited college containing citizenship material, the must for overseas migrants who need to learn English.

    The Life in the UK test is for overseas migrants who already have a good knowledge of the language.

    Either one, an accredited ESOL certificate or a Life in the UK certificate suffice to claim permanent residency. ILR.
    Either or both can be passed within the period of the first 27 month temporary Visa. ILR cannot be applied for though until you have been resident in the UK for 24 months.
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    davidmckendrick
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 30/11/10, 09:13 pm

    Hi Alan,
    Thanks for the clarifications.

    David
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by Chris Seaborn on 01/12/10, 07:20 am

    David wrote.."Even Australians and Americans have to sit the "Life in the UK" test if they want ILR even though they do not need to pass an ESOL exam"

    I think you might be wrong there David. LOL.
    Chris.
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davidmckendrick on 01/12/10, 09:50 am

    Hi Chris,
    This information was given to me by an Australian when she gave me her "Life in the UK" book for Mei after passing the test.
    David

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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by davext on 02/12/10, 12:21 am

    Hi folks regarding above topic for Aus if permanant residency no test required / to become Aus citzen yes Davext
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by wanneroo on 02/12/10, 03:25 am

    I havent heard of any tests either here in Australia, I was surpised to hear from my Sister in the UK that if you marry in the UK say a park or or anywhere else you are under control of the local by laws, you cannot get married on the beach or a friends beautiful garden, you have to select a registered area nominated by local councils, I glad I am out of the UK, so much red tape and control,its everywhere I know, but this seems a little over the top no freedom Evil or Very Mad we are allowed to marry wherever here,
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    Re: Repeat FLR visas

    Post by Chris Seaborn on 02/12/10, 03:54 am

    Hi David, I was refering to "life in the UK" test, Davex is right, we have no English test to gain P/R and we would not have to pass a test about Life in the United Kingdom and I'm sure the American cousins don't have to either. During Ying's telephone 'Interview' for the initial visa she had to answer 3 questions that were given in English and she had to answer them in English. As Davex has stated, for Australian Citizenship passing a test about life in Australia is required. Answering Wanneroos slight diviation re permission to use parks etc in which to get married, it must be a State thing, in Victoria, your local council may indeed have local by-laws requiring permission to use public spaces. Our's have, something to do with Insurance.

    Chris.

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